Mashaba Hints at Mayoral Candidacy, Refuses to Back Zille
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JEREMY MAGGS: Let’s start with the current political environment. As we near the local government elections next year, ActionSA leader Herman Mashaba seems poised to enter the race for Johannesburg. He has hinted at a potential collaboration with the Democratic Alliance (DA), albeit with caveats, noting that the DA’s former associations have adversely affected its appeal among black voters.
Mashaba is championing what he terms black excellence, amidst coalition discussions suggesting the ANC (African National Congress) may look to him to curb Helen Zille from securing a position in city hall. Hermann Mashaba joins me now on the show.
Herman, welcome. Reports suggest you’re open to collaborating with the DA in Johannesburg. I’m wondering what has changed, considering you previously stated those affiliations harmed your party’s support. Can you explain?
HERMAN MASHABA: Good afternoon, Jeremy, and to our listeners. I want to make it clear that I haven’t officially committed to anything. What I have indicated is that ActionSA will announce its candidate for Johannesburg at the right moment.
I’ll consider stepping up only if we cannot identify another suitable candidate, like Nasiphi Moya. You might recall my struggles in Tshwane, where I had significant issues with the DA regarding services for townships, ultimately leading to the decision to replace them with Dr. Nasiphi Moya, who has done exceptional work. I’m very proud of her.
Read: ‘GNU should learn from Tshwane budget’: Mashaba
Thus, my candidacy is contingent on the absence of a suitable alternative, but I urge the people of Johannesburg to provide us some flexibility, as the city is in chaos, largely due to the ANC.
On the subject of the DA, my past experience speaks volumes. Back in 2016, I transitioned my business management to my wife to join forces with the DA in ousting the ANC, which we achieved successfully on our first attempt.
However, I faced resistance from certain DA members who believed I was prioritizing the needs of poorer communities. What was particularly frustrating was the suggestion that I entered politics merely to serve the party.
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I entered politics to serve society, especially the marginalized and disadvantaged.
I reside in Atholl, Sandton, and as I gaze across the freeway toward Alexandra, I questioned: instead of leaving the country, why not engage in politics? If these ANC individuals can govern, surely I can contribute too. I didn’t even grasp the full scope of a mayor’s duties back then.
Now, looking back to 2021, ActionSA performed commendably in Tshwane, Ekurhuleni, and Johannesburg, where we strategically backed the DA to prevent the ANC from regaining control. Although disappointed with the situation in Tshwane, I learned invaluable lessons from my political experiences. Initially, I vowed never to align with the ANC, but the reality is that decisions ultimately rest with the voters.
JEREMY MAGGS: Herman, I find it hard to believe you would consider working with the DA again given your past experiences. Isn’t this merely a political necessity on your part?
HERMAN MASHABA: No, I’m not implying that I would solely collaborate with the DA.
JEREMY MAGGS: I didn’t say solely; I just pointed out the possibility of collaboration with the DA.
HERMAN MASHABA: I am willing to work with any party if it meets the voters’ demands. For instance, in Johannesburg, an outright majority requires 272 councillors, and it’s clear that no party will reach that alone. ActionSA is firm in stating we won’t dismiss any collaboration outright with the ANC or the DA. The real question is the conditions under which we’ll engage. The paramount condition is that corruption must be declared a public enemy.
We demand a written coalition agreement that stipulates corruption is our number one enemy.
Moreover, we must ensure delivery of services to every community, not just those who supported us. These are non-negotiable conditions should we find ourselves needing to ally with the DA or the ANC.
Lastly, if the DA genuinely wants to partner with ActionSA, they must agree to combat illegal immigration into our city. That’s what I meant in my earlier interviews.
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Read: Over 51,000 undocumented migrants deported since the GNU took power – Schreiber
JEREMY MAGGS: You’ve raised the stakes, particularly regarding the DA’s support for deporting undocumented migrants. How would this be executed?
HERMAN MASHABA: Precisely. If they are unwilling to deport illegal foreigners, then there will be no agreement since ActionSA is adamant: all illegal foreigners must return to their home nations.
Currently, over 54% of our citizens struggle for basic necessities in areas lacking adequate services. It’s ludicrous to think that we should accommodate millions globally while failing to support our own citizens.
Listen/read: Report: Life in SA is becoming unaffordable for the majority
At ActionSA, this matter is non-negotiable. Any party requesting our support must be ready to deport illegal immigrants; otherwise, they are wasting both our time and theirs.
JEREMY MAGGS: There’s speculation that the ANC might depend on you to prevent Helen Zille from coming to power. Do you feel comfortable playing the role of a kingmaker—focusing on stopping someone rather than presenting a concrete plan?
Read: ANC benefits from too many ‘kingmakers’ with large egos in SA [Oct 2024]
HERMAN MASHABA: We are open to working with any party willing to meet those three non-negotiable conditions. Our aim is not to obstruct any candidate from the elections.
We respect the rights of any South African who wishes to contest, be they Helen Zille or anyone else, and we will not collaborate with others to hinder their participation.
JEREMY MAGGS: In your opinion, who would make a better mayor, Helen Zille or Dada Morero?
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HERMAN MASHABA: Neither. I have no confidence in either candidate.
JEREMY MAGGS: Why is that?
HERMAN MASHABA: Dada Morero—just look at Johannesburg’s current condition. And Helen Zille—she is partly responsible for the challenges we face in this city during my time as mayor.
JEREMY MAGGS: But you remain open to collaborating with both their parties, just not with the individuals directly.
HERMAN MASHABA: Correct. I view both candidates similarly. In 2019, while I was investigating serious fraud and corruption involving ANC leaders, Helen Zille approached them to suggest a motion of no confidence against me, claiming she’d secure support from white councillors. That makes her complicit in my view.
Read/listen: GNU on the verge? What Zille and the Presidency have to say
JEREMY MAGGS: Lastly, how can you contemplate working with the DA or the ANC while dismissing both their mayoral candidates?
HERMAN MASHABA: Jeremy, governing Johannesburg demands 136 out of 270 councillors. If we find ourselves in a coalition, which is typical in South Africa and elsewhere, we can collaborate with those around us. My purpose in politics is not to forge personal relationships, but to serve my country.
In any coalition scenario, I am prepared to work together. However, certain principles are non-negotiable, which I have articulated here.
JEREMY MAGGS: Thank you for your time, Herman Mashaba. He is the leader of ActionSA. Tomorrow, we’re scheduled to chat with the DA’s Helen Zille.
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